[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hello, I'm Jeremy Rivera and I'm your unscripted SEO podcast host for today. I'm talking to Giselle, and she runs House Fresh. She's going to introduce her brand.
This is kind of a special conversation because she's volunteered to kind of talk about SEO, technical SEO, and answer some different questions because definitely big movement for her, for her brand, back and forth and. And after seeing a ping pong ball of a conversation bounce around an ex, I throw, hey, want to talk about it? So we'll get into the details of that, but first, I want to give her a platform and kind of say, what would you say you do here, Tazelle?
[00:00:46] Speaker B: First of all, thank you for having me.
And what I do day to day is I am the managing editor of Housefresh.com, the website, and then I'm also a producer for, for our YouTube channel, and I'm the person behind all of our social media accounts and I also run our subreddit, so I wear a lot of hats.
And what we do at House Fresh is we just test and review air quality products.
So, you know, we are well known for air purifiers, but we also test air quality sensors, dehumidifiers, humidifiers, fans, different types of fans.
So what we do day in and day out most than anything is just test and develop methodologies and improve upon them so that we are constantly adding new data points and find new ways to just put the units to a test to really see what they can do and where they fail.
And we don't, you know, on our website, we don't run ads, we don't do sponsorships. Every product that we, we review, we buy ourselves.
And in cases where we have, for example, we are based in the uk, but we want to test a product from the US and we can't buy it. What we end up doing is we ask the manufacturer for a charity of their choice and we will put the money of what we will pay for the product into the charity, just because we want to be very clear that we have no connection and we want to be unbiased and we want to be able to say what we think, really without having to be forced to manicure the outcome of a review.
So that's what we do every day.
[00:02:34] Speaker A: I think that's very powerful.
And it's a challenge when you're in that space of running a business, not to be swayed by the offers. I'm sure that you've been proposed here and there of, hey, come and test for us. And I respect that. And I think it's something that, you know, as we are inundated with so much digital marketing that having, you know, actual testing sources that try to remain unbiased talk about that being transparent about their processes is so important for trust.
And that's, you know, that's part of eeat right, that Google talks about often about their expertise, their view on expertise, expertise, authority and trust. I'm curious if Google has treated you well with your public statements of that or if your experience with organic Google traffic has been an up and down relationship.
[00:03:39] Speaker B: Okay, so I think we, for a long time we started the website, we started working on the site in 2019. I think we didn't go live. We ended up during COVID We had to stop everything because Covid and we also wanted to make sure we had enough tests to be able to actually launch a meaningful website.
So we started publishing properly in 2021. And 2021 was great, 2022 was great, 2023 was great. And then when we get to, I think September 2023 before Google rolled out, I don't even know how many updates in like between September and December before they, they baked everything into the core algorithm. So when they used to have the product review update and you know, there was all these different layers of what they were updating, that's when we started dropping. And what we started noticing was that who, who was rising and then we, we, we got together with a bunch of different independent publishers in different spaces and the stories were the same, we were all competing with the same websites. She's like, how can it be that, you know, I'm reviewing an air purifier and you are reviewing a pair of trainers and you are reviewing a Star Trek show and we are all competing with Forbes? Like, how can that be right?
So I think for us, we started seeing a very quick downfall of traffic between September 2023 and January 2024.
And that's what prompted us to write our first article, which we wrote in February, right before the March core update of 2024 that actually dropped us to nearly nothing. All the traffic we were getting to the site was because of that article that we wrote where we just called it out and we just said, look, there are some guidelines in our space with product reviews. The guidelines were very clear. If anything, the product review algorithm updates were helping our website every time.
So they talk about actual firsthand data.
They were very clear with what they wanted. And then we were able to show that what was actually ranking was very Far from that. To the point where we were competing against buzzfeed Listicle, that was just grabbing quotes from Amazon reviewers and putting like an image from an Amazon reviewer. So at a glance you might think, oh, yeah, maybe they have this product because it looks like it's not just a photo from Amazon. It's like, no, no, it's from a reviewer on Amazon. And then a quote underneath of this reviewer, a random person saying it's great or not. And some cases that the people were saying they weren't good, but obviously whoever built that page, whether it was a person or they just used AI, it was just, it made no sense. And they were like, 53 great air purifiers. And like, there are no 53 great air profiles. Like, you know, like, so it was crazy. So we got to show that. And I think that initially got some attention of people that had done product reviews in the past that were now working in media organizations. So. So we had Niemann Lab, they covered it right away.
That opened up to a lot of journalists or people in the journalism community just talking about their experience of what was happening in the places where they were working and how this was completely separated from the newsroom. And that got the attention of Google.
They got in touch and they invited us to come on a call.
So we were.
It was House Fresh and also Retro Dodo, who they. Not long after our first article, they released a video that they basically shared a similar story.
So it was Brandon and I and Danny and a bunch of people that we couldn't see who were the search team.
And they just asked us a load of questions about how we work and how we create content.
And that was our first say, connection with Google.
And then from there we were invited to go and travel to the Googleplex or whatever it's called, the HQ. And then we spent the full day with 20 or 19 other websites from different sections, like different sectors of the web, and a bunch of engineers and just, you know, just talking about what, what we could do or what could they do really, how could they, how could their systems be improved so that sites like ours weren't getting destroyed?
And they, you know, I think after that they just said, it's going to take a long time, it's never going to come back to where it was.
A lot of sites closed, a lot of people just went into getting jobs while they waited to see whether something did change. And we saw a change for us that started in August 2024, I think. No.
Yes.
I think so. So year 24 so that's when we started showing up again with our name. Like, basic stuff, you know, you can search for cardsfresh, you actually find us, not a Reddit post of somebody talking about us.
So that's when we started small, small steps towards starting to rank again. And, and then with every, you know, that they rolled out, when they rolled out the algorithmic section of the site, reputation abuse, that they actually was released in the middle of all this of, of our, I think it was like our circle blog post. And then suddenly it's our reputation abuse. And it was all very.
But for me, it's like a cloud of something that. I don't remember what happened first or second, but it was all at the same time, it felt like.
And that really helped us because I think that dropped down a lot of sites that were 100% abusing the reputation. And I personally think that Google opened up more spaces for smaller websites.
So what I saw at the end of 2023 was that they were closing that down, that there was smaller websites were not getting in.
And maybe it's a pattern they built. Whatever pattern they built, it was definitely just leaving the biggest to the top, whether that biggest was a retailer or a magazine or a newspaper or some big forum or anything that wasn't a small hobbyist website.
So I think after that August 2024 update and then in March 2025, that's when we started seeing, okay, in the product review space, they figure something out or they tweak something, because not just in our space in air quality, but also, you know, in apparel.
You know, there's, there's a couple of, of known examples of, like, websites that they review shoes and they review and, you know, ski equipment and things like that. And they all. We all started seeing, okay, I think maybe that conversation with Google, that day we spent there with the engineers, when we were brainstorming, how can you make sure. How can you. How can. The question was how can the robot figure it out, that this is a real human piece of content. That's what we're trying to give them ideas for. And I think that might have worked out somehow because that's when we started seeing improvements. And since then, I like to note, check at all. Like, I just pay attention to our traffic. And I'm not looking at, you know, I don't look at analytics. I don't, I'm not checking where we are ranking.
I'm not. I just try not to just. Because I don't think I can handle it. Like, if I see it again, it's gonna just kill me. I don't think I can do it twice of like going down to nothing.
So I just focus on traffic and focus on trying to get people on the side from other sources and for them to spend a meaningful amount of time on the website.
So it's a really long story, really. Sorry, sorry, sorry. People listening to this, I know.
[00:12:09] Speaker A: Not at all. That's actually, that's the story that we actually want to hear. Because, you know, I've worked with a number of different brands that were hit by hcu, a number of small creators who, you know, they had their niche.
One was in the review space, but another was in the cooking space and recipe space. And you know, everybody listening to, to this is either had a client that was squeezed by it or, you know, had worked with somebody that, that came across this. You know, it's definitely, you know, one of those moments in SEO history and so getting like a firsthand perspective and at least knowing, hey, like, Google did see that they were squeezing and, you know, made some type of course correction of some type of, um. I'm curious if, because it does seem to coincide with some of the other changes of, you know, releasing LLMs. Like, concurrent with 2024, 2023, ChatGPT hits the major, major main news stream and Everybody's like, oh, ChatGPT. And then Google has to rush its product out. So I wonder if, you know, if what's been your experience with the addition of LLM technology
[00:13:28] Speaker B: stepping in, I'm laughing, sorry. Just because once everything was kind of settling and we were like, oh, great, you know, things got better and then they rolled out AI overviews and we were like, okay.
And that's when, you know, the whole.
The great decoupling or whatever they call it happened. And then suddenly, you know, our impressions were through the roof and our clicks kept falling, even though the positions were holding, which is kind of where we are at the moment.
So I think for us, we don't use AI like LLMs for writing or for images or we don't use it for anything really.
So we don't get the benefit, I guess, if there is such a thing as benefit of being able to pump up a lot of content quickly or whatever.
We do think that, that we have a big following of people who also don't like AI, who will read our reviews and they appreciate that we are people, that we are humans that are telling this, you know, are sharing data that they gather themselves and they're not just regurgitating or whatever.
And from a point of traffic, we get traffic from some of these tools. We haven't blocked the bots and we have. We had a long conversation about whether we should block them just from, I guess from a point of generating some form of pressure for the publishers to be compensated for the work that we put in, that we don't get to be compensated because we are not People Inc. Or whatever. We are not the New York Times. So we don't get a seat at the table as small publishers.
But the only reason we have decided against it is because we feel like if at least they will, we would rather that they are, they are using our information and recommending a good product than they are not.
Mainly because we have seen what happened. There was a big wildfire in New York whilst we were not ranking and our website was nowhere to be found.
And then after, once we were ranking and once there were other wildfires and we started getting emails from people and they were telling us what they bought during that first wildfire and how it was, you know, they were terrible units that they were buying, that they did nothing for them, that just a waste of money. But also potentially, you know, it could be very bad for their health if they are in a really bad situation where they need to shelter and they need to stay in place waiting for, you know, to be rescued or whatever. And it's like, no, I would rather they will eat our information.
It's fine. But at least recommend something good.
So that's how we have seen it. We might change our mind if it gets ridiculous. I think we are lucky that we use Kinsta and Kinsta blocks bots. So we are not getting a lot of. We don't have to pay for these crazy visits that we do get.
And we are also lucky that our website is still quite small. So we don't have lots of calls across hundreds and hundreds of pages every single second.
So our infrastructure is not suffering. But we know of other small websites that actually have database websites and they are struggling. So it's a complicated landscape.
[00:16:51] Speaker A: Well, yeah, it's challenging because the old paradigm of hey, just build great content and we'll send traffic to you.
That was the devil's bargain, right? Hey, Google said, hey, let us borrow your information and we promise that we'll pass along this traffic and then when that, you know, that changes, it kind of changes the game overall for, you know, somebody that's in your position that does want to do something good of, you know, doing these unbiased reviews, if they don't follow through on their side and. And then another person enters the scene and they're. They're not even saying that they're going to honor that same agreement on the upfront. They're like, hey, we're going to read your stuff and we're going to, you know, re. We might not even mention that it came from you. You know, we might even like we'll reuse your review information that you built and you know, maybe we'll give you a citation. Yeah, it's hard because the attribution funnel is so shattered. I've heard it called the dark funnel now.
But there were some strange artifacts of behavior from it of.
I have heard, I have seen research that if you do surface in a LLM, it actually leads to a five.
You're five times more likely to go and look up that website.
You know, once they do recommend it, like you're five times more likely. But it's not. It. It comes through to you as a brand search through Google. So it's like this layer of detachment of. Because people don't trust LLMs, they shouldn't.
Not flat out, but there's even, you know, the AI slop narrative is kind of like because we were pushed so quickly into this as a culture, like we've been beta tested on so hard of so much being released so quickly in a new model and a new model and no, no this. And it hasn't had that careful construction of how software got released in the 90s. In 2010, the whole operating system almost didn't launch just because the way that it was put up at a press release.
[00:19:15] Speaker B: No, I think now it's like the whole that move fast and break things mentality that that is literally how step one move fast and break things. That was basically the recipe of everything they did. I think for us from a.
What I see. I'm not, I'm not. I don't. We don't pay for tools to see visibility on ChatGPT. I think there is a degree as well of personalization of everything right now that even if you want to look at, I don't know, I see AHREFS data and then I see our actual data and they're like, yeah, I'm not going to say AHREFS has no idea but obviously they have lost a lot of data. And also what I think there's a. So particularly when it comes to like value of traffic, when you think oh, being number one used to represent this amount of money and being number one right now, it's like being Number five, you know, five years ago. And it's just.
It's not. I think in general, I don't look at tools. What I look at as is the traffic on the site and their behavior. And one of the things I have noticed is that people who come from chatgpt, from Claw, from Gemini, they spend very little amount of time on the site, like around two minutes. And then people who come from Reddit, YouTube, they spend six to eight minutes on the site and they will go to multiple pages. And I think there's something about perhaps also this really fast answer, give me an answer kind of thing of just opening just to check, but not necessarily. It's not a discovery or a browsing behavior that you will have when you're coming from Reddit. And if you're doing research on a product or you ask a question on Reddit about, I don't know, I have. My girlfriend has a cat, and it's just killing me when I go, stay there. And is there anything we can do? And then somebody recommends check out house Fresh. And then you go House Fresh. And then it starts a journey that you are already on. Whereas I feel like the traffic we're getting from LLMs is people that is coming maybe to tech, um, but not necessarily to find. They already found because the LLM told them so.
[00:21:30] Speaker A: Right. So they're just like, verifying.
[00:21:32] Speaker B: Yes. Yeah. So less about exploring the site and more about, you know, just. Which I appreciate they're doing, and I hope they keep doing that. And in two minutes, I have changed the way I think about the pages because I know that people right now are not spending a lot of time on the site. So then I try.
So in the first two scrolls, they get everything that they need, and then if they want to go deeper, they can.
But I've already changed the way that we present the information on the site because of that. And the same with our videos. Our videos are built so that in the first three to four minutes you got everything you need, and then you can stay and watch more and see more and find out more.
But yeah, it's very different type of traffic. And I don't know if it's the same for other people. I have seen the claims that actually traffic from ChatGPT is more engaged and it performs better and it stays longer. And it's like, well, it doesn't match with what I see comparing to something like Reddit or YouTube or actual social networks, and where I know the traffic coming from, there is more likely to be a human being um, so yeah,
[00:22:49] Speaker A: it's kind of a trade off. It's, it's. You kind of sit in an in between space too because there's an aspect of, you know, you're providing like vetting for an end brand.
So you're kind of, you know, like your model does rely, you know, you do send traffic onto the Amazon site for them to purchase whatever you honestly reviewed, you know, and that's, I understand that's how you make your money at the end of the day.
But you know, for LLMs or for somebody, you know, exterior to that, not going that full path, they're just like, oh, is it the JB75? Oh, she likes the JB75. And then they're looking up that. Yeah. Then they go back and then they're oh, tell me about the JB75 more. And then, you know, cut, kind of cutting you out of the loop.
[00:23:37] Speaker B: But yeah, which I think with AI overviews it's even worse because what the AI overview does and AI mode is exactly the same, it will be just like they might put our video and mention us five times and all of that.
But then when they mention the product and it's hyperlinked and you click on that, it doesn't send you to my review of the product.
It opens up a shopping panel which has all the deals and their reviews of like, I don't know, that they took from Walmart or whatever place that they are gathering the reviews for shopping for that one product at that one time.
And it's basically a 5% off, 10 seconds to go free delivery, like ping, ping, ping, bing, bing, bing, just click, click, click, click. And we sold that unit because maybe we are the ones that sell. It's really cool. The data shows these blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. The images that they use are ours. The video that they show is us. The name that they use to say a conversation in two house fresh is us.
But then the link, it's obviously a shopping partner.
And I think that I expect the same from ChatGPT and I expect the same from all the LLMs eventually once they get the deals done or what they get the functionality or how to do it so that it doesn't feel weird, that is what's going to happen. They will use us to sell the thing and then get the commission or give the commission to their partner.
So it caused them in.
[00:25:14] Speaker A: So does that lead to looking to build alternate channels? I have to Admit as an SEO there was a good 10 year stretch where my sole focus was, hey, just Getting more traffic and thinking organic just meant optimizing for Google. And we had a very specific way build links, do your keyword research and you write the article article, you know, build more links, you know, check on technical SEO. But it feels like now, you know, the, the version for brands has to be more holistic of. Well, how can I, you know, tap into other channels of what other platforms can I earnestly participate in or build communities in? So can you touch on some of the community building aspect of living on Reddit?
Which is fascinating to me because I've been on Reddit for 20 years, I've got an ancient account there and you know, it's, it's definitely a strange place when it comes to respecting both really being rigid about not wanting corpo influence shills like hugely anti shill, but also at the same time will viciously turn on somebody and then turn around and bring one brand up out of 10 and raise them out for no apparent reason other than they just broke through. So what's been your experience?
[00:26:49] Speaker B: So first of all, I think the problem with all of this is that what we would think at some point as well, you have these multiple channels and right now they are all walled gardens and tomorrow From Reddit to YouTube to X2, all of them can turn around similarly as Google did and drop us all.
And none of this is ours like just because we, it's our community here, it's not.
So I think our focus in general for any channel we are in, and I'll tell you a bit more in a second of which ones we have, is for people to, to know us and appreciate us for what we are providing and always be there for them.
So a lot of what we do is actually answering questions.
Our subreddit, we open the subreddit so we are not going into other subreddits to answer questions. That's the type of stuff that, yeah, it's like behavior that. I've also been on Reddit since basically since they launched. I used to be on Digg and then Reddit came out and I was like, ah, just give it a try. I know there was a big battle at the time of whether it was better or worse, but I wanted to try it. And since then I've been on Reddit and so has my husband. Danny has been on Reddit probably longer than I have because he was on Dig before I was.
So we know the rules and we understand why and we actually appreciate that about Reddit and I really hope that Reddit doesn't go down in this madness that is the Internet right now, Reddit still, even with all the spam and all the AI and all the, you know, all the shills, and it still is a place where people are online.
So I think we just. We created a subreddit as a place to answer questions, as a place to. We do share some of our stuff. We're not sharing every new video, we're not sharing every article.
We do share things that perhaps it's not quite an article, it's not quite a video, but we know people want to know. So a lot of the work we do is in DIY units. So things you can do yourself at home using different parts.
And so then perhaps it's just a simple hack. It's just like, oh, we changed this filter and we got this better performance, so we just make a little Reddit post and we put the data there. And so I think initially when we started this subreddit, we did it because our website wasn't ranking and Reddit was.
So what we saw at that time was, okay, well, I sat down with the Google results and I was like, well, where could I rank here so I could rank in the images?
I could rank. They're pulling social media posts from Instagram and Facebook. Okay, I could rank there.
And then there's all this Reddit stuff. I could rank there. I tried Quora. It's just like. It's like a no man's land. It's not real. Like, Quora used to be something, but it's not real. So I was like, I'm not gonna waste my time here just because it's gonna rank like, it just felt like doing. I don't know, it was a waste of time, really. So then I stuck with Reddit. And initially it was a place for us to share stuff that wasn't ranking, that most cases were like, maybe reviews that were critical, that we were like, okay, every other review of this product is bought and paid for right now. So let's make the post on Reddit about it not being so great so that at least it ranks. And then people decide if they want to see.
And then what started happening is that community started forming and people started coming.
There is a subreddit that is called our air Purifiers, which we are not part of, and we don't post there, and they are their own thing, but people would go and maybe post a question there and post a question on House Fresh and maybe post a question on our air quality, for example.
And what we have now is A community of people that answer questions. So it doesn't have to just be us that come and answer. Except for some very, like, we got some questions yesterday and this morning that I have to go and take out because they're a bit more technical, but in general, other members of the community can answer. And then what we do have on Reddit is there are a lot of people that.
They saw something that happened with us Fresh that had nothing to do with Google, which is we had a manufacturer who tried to sue us because of our review.
And they.
At the same time we were getting these legal letters, we were getting bots or like, we were getting down votes bombed in a way, on YouTube. Our video was taken down due to some.
I think it was like a counterfeit claim that was completely automated.
And then our page, our website page got taken down. We started to get negative SEO, so, like, links, spam, spam, spammy links to that page. So all this was happening and we reached out to a few people, and one of these people that we reached out to was. It's one of the owners of Linus Media Group. So Linus Tech Tips, which is like a big YouTuber that does tech content.
And we just reached out asking for some advice on what to do with the video of, like, can we talk to anybody on YouTube? Because right now we were like, from automated answer to automated answer. And in the middle of all that, they were like, what's happening here? We told them the whole story and they said, there's a story here and people need to know that there are brands that are doing this to review us. And Linus took an interest because he's a product reviewer, and obviously they wouldn't do it to him.
So then we did a video with Linus where we talked about this specific product and the situation and everything. And that video got millions of views. So then a lot of people got to know House Fresh, and a lot of those people are on Reddit. So then even since. Since that point, which. And this was like last year, April, I think April or May last year, they still today will message and recommend House Fresh to anybody that might be thinking about getting an air purifier or if they see somebody that is unsure, and this is all these different subreddits. So, like, from Buy it for Life, which is a big subreddit for people looking for products to, you know, just random, like, I don't know, like indoor growers or like just random subreddits, where these people are.
And that really also helped us getting this voice around House Fresh. And it's not us saying that, it's just people. We don't even know who they are.
But they, they learned about our story. And something similar happened on X. So we were already quite big on X, even though we were small. And when we wrote our first article, one of the first things that came out of a bunch of really high profile SEO people, we were not a brand. You're not a brand. And we were a brand within the air quality space, which is very small. We were the product reviewers of that space.
The manufacturers knew us, people came to us. So on X, which is not a massive community of air quality, but it's there.
We were already quite active.
But since, since the Google, the first Google article and then what happened with this manufacturer that tried to sue us, we started amassing a bigger following. It's still quite small in the context of like people have thousands and thousands or even millions of followers. We don't have that. And I don't think it makes sense for us to have million followers. Like it's air purifiers and dehumidifiers, you know, like, people are not so into it.
But it did attract a lot of people. And similarly, like, even on threads, like on Instagram, and what I do is I just use every account. I create content that makes sense for those accounts. So something I will share on Instagram obviously is not the same as something I would share on X, because on Instagram they want to see the house, they want to see the device, how it looks in a corner, they want to see this. And then on X maybe they want to see the data and, and it's very different. And even the language that we're using is quite different.
So I think what I've done over the last few years is just understand who these people are who are following us and then being always available. Like they message us every day. Like, we spend all morning, Danny spends all morning answering emails and messages on YouTube and I spend all morning going through all my DMs and just messages that we get across all the channels. And we are the human LLMs. They come and they say, oh, I have a big.
My basement is this by this and I have a dump. And I live in this country. And you're like, okay, well give me a minute, what's your budget? And we are just constantly there for them. And I think that's what then makes them tag us more and thank us and then they would buy us a coffee. So maybe they can't use an affiliate link, but they come and just buy us a coffee. And it slowly started growing and hopefully will continue to.
[00:36:15] Speaker A: That's amazing.
And I think the lesson there is you have to understand what the audience there is and what the audience wants. And if Google as an audience is shrinking down than these alternative venues and channels, you know, respecting, like you said, you don't own it, but it is still, you know, each platform is unique and you do. If you play by play by the rules of engagement there and kind of read the room, then you can kind of have some interesting success. Like I've had some strange success on threads myself just because, you know, like if you talk once about podcasting, like, oh, you're into, you're a podcaster, like, you want all of this podcast stuff.
So I have an unending pool of, you know, potential guests of people that are like, I want to start a podcast or I want to be on a podcast. Okay, well, so my last question is kind of about the future for yourself and your team.
What do you think you're going to be doing for the next couple of years as new tech rolls out?
Is there like a long term game plan or is it, you know, let's just keep tinkering and adjusting as things come down the line.
[00:37:47] Speaker B: So one of the big things is just to keep, I guess, expanding the products that we test.
And it takes time because for every product, first of all, we need to develop a methodology. And you know, we are launching like one to two new products every year because we can't right now do more than that. And then for the following year, that means, you know, we are now, we are testing five, six different things. So then there's six different types of new products we have to buy, six different methodologies that we have to improve for next year.
So we can't suddenly. And we would never go in and be like, oh, well, tomorrow, you know, we are doing like reviews of Star Trek shows or you know, just go all Forbes on it. Like, we wouldn't do that.
I think we're going to stay with indoor air quality. We really, we care a lot about the topic. I think we know a lot about the topic. And there are lots of different layers to it. And also, you know, the world is not, the air is not getting cleaner and the world tends to get hotter or more extreme in terms of temperature. And that can also affect the air in your house. So there's a lot more that we can do in terms of products which also, that's where we also listening to what we are told, because a lot of the products that we are, that we are releasing now that we have been testing, they come from email upon email of people saying, can you just please review a humidifier? Or like a Reddit post of can you just please, you know, please, just please, I'm okay, let's do it. If they wanted, we wouldn't just go out of nowhere with a product. So that's one thing I think from the site itself.
I still want to have a website. I still want to believe in the web and the Internet.
I think there is still, at least there is a couple of generations of people who are still used to reading and searching and browsing and going their own, doing their own journey to get to things.
So I think having a good website where you land and there's no ads and pop ups, it's like it's even a Zen experience at this point.
So I think I still believe in that and I will still. There are loads of improvements we're going to work on for next year that I'm very excited about.
We are also thinking about or we're already planning on doing it, but we haven't started it yet. Working on an app, which it's.
I personally don't. In my life, I don't want another app for things like I don't. If I could have less apps, I will be happy. But there are certain things that for on a website we couldn't do that will help people personalize their experience. That with an app will make it a lot easier.
And we already have a lot of requests of things that we know people want that we usually have to, you know, send me a photo, do this, do that, that with an app. It will be as simple as like point your camera and we would be able to help them. So that is something that we want to do.
And we already have like our first, you know, V1 of what it would be. And I think, well, the problem Danny has is that I have very high standards.
So then I'll be like Danny, the whole like move fast and break things. He probably will be more into that. And I'll be like, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. I wanted to, I want it to be, you know, I don't want it to break. Can we just try it so it doesn't break?
So, so I put a stop on something sometimes just to try to get them right.
And I think there's a degree of building this community that we have already started here in the uk connecting to organizations that are trying to bring air Purifiers into schools and air quality sensors into schools just so that teachers can make decisions like, let's open the window because the CO2 is crazy and we're all getting sleepy. And, you know, there are basic things that can be enacted that are not very expensive.
So we're already working with a couple of organizations who are in general, their parents or moms even in most cases, just sharing our data and sharing our expertise.
I think we would want to do more of that, connect with more organizations, maybe just start hosting more workshops and things to try to bring awareness of what can be done and not from a point of fear, which I think sometimes, you know, air purifier fires will have been great during COVID but nobody wants to talk about COVID so you can't go into Covid. But there are all these other reasons why, like right now, I think maybe with wildfires. This summer we had wildfires here where I live, and it was terrifying because. And I've been writing about wildfires for years and I know exactly what to do. And it still was like, I can't, you know, is it happening? It's happening. And I think a lot of people felt that way. And the sudden it's like, yeah, maybe it is happening. But here are the three things you can do about it. And maybe we can, we can start helping provide this information in a more personable way, in an easier to understand way, more engaging as well. So I think there's a lot of advice, you know, if you go into the epa. Well, now a lot of it is offline, but there used to be great advice on the, on the BPA and the CDC and. But sometimes you through it and it's like pages and pages of stuff or a PDF or it's like, well, how about I give you three steps, simple things.
So I think we can do a lot, help educate more and perhaps connecting these people who are working with the people who are actually also trying to help in other places that perhaps are already getting some wins so that they can help each other, becoming more of this nexus between organizations that are right now already doing really good work. So we're already starting that path. I can see ourselves getting deeper into that.
And yeah, I mean, it's hard to think about, you know, five years from now, because I think, oh, five years ago, and I had no idea I would be even here.
So who knows? But I hope that we will be able to build a stronger in person community or people who know each other in person, because I think perhaps that's where things are going.
We need more connection between people and I think we can do that from a meaningful place in the space in which we are.
[00:44:39] Speaker A: I agree. I had a great conversation with Andy Choi of Do Good Things and like he his organization works to partner with for profits to find nonprofits who have a similar mission space. You know, and so it occurs to me like, you know, I just interviewed somebody who works in schools and she brings, you know, after school sport programs but she, she hired the teachers for to be the coaches. So I'm just wondering, you know, hey, I should bounce you over because that's getting into classrooms. That's a huge like every fall kid kids get smashed into those small rooms and you know, good air filtration is hard to come by when they're in older real estate. There's lots of mold and air quality is dubious with 40, 40 mouth breathing kids.
[00:45:33] Speaker B: Yeah. And also, and that is also assuming that outside the air is clean. But if you think, oh yeah, most of lots of schools are near, you know, busy roads. Yeah. And then it's like, well, you can't even. But I think one of the things that we started doing is developing like a program that schools, we want to trial it on our kids school of just doing a workshop with the children and in different age groups there are different things. You can teach them about air quality and by the end of it they can build an air purifier and they can learn about, you know, electronics, they can learn about physics because you have to think about the air and how can you funnel the air and all these things.
So there's so much you can do. You can turn it into a class and by the end of it, every classroom has an amplifier. So, you know, I can see good things happening. We just have to make them happen instead of just waiting for them to happen. Basically.
[00:46:33] Speaker A: Well, you've been very open and honest and I can see why people turn to you and look for honesty in the reviews.
Thank you so much for spending time with me.
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Thanks so much for your time. I'll make sure that everything, all your communities, your site gets fully linked in the show notes. Thanks for stopping by.
[00:47:19] Speaker B: Thank you so much for having me. And it was really enjoyable talk, so I hope people will have a good time listening to it.
[00:47:26] Speaker A: Adios.
[00:47:27] Speaker B: Bye.
